On Sunday evening, about 3,000 people showed up at Fresno's City Hall to celebrate the state Supreme Court decision that upheld Proposition 8. That rally came a day after supporters of same-sex marriage held a rally at City Hall. Click here for the latest story on the rally in support of traditional marriage.
"It's not Prop. 8 anymore," said organizer Jim Franklin. "It's now an official part of our constitution. It upholds the people's right to govern themselves and it defines marriage in the state of California as between one man and one woman."
A day earlier, supporters of same-sex marriage rallied at City Hall. The group included Hollywood celebrities Charlize Theron and T.J. Knight of the TV show "Gray's Anatomy." Click here for a story on that rally.
My bet is we'll have less then 76 comments on this thread then the other, on this subject.
Interesting! I’m getting a real education on "gay" media distortion! The local gay fresno web site says there was only 300-400 pro-marriage individuals at Sunday night’s rally. That laughable! I was there - easily 10 times that amount! The question that I have is: why would they deliberately distort the number when it was so obviously otherwise?
The 50 or so heterophobic protestors tried their best to deny pro-marriage supporters their right of free speech (by contrast, the previous night, evangelicals accorded gay supporters their free speech rights; I guess this is what passes for "tolerance" in the gay crowd).
I’m wondering if today, if local gay activist, Jason Scott’s activities will be accurately reported in the news media. I personally saw him last night, in several instances, try to provoke a confrontation - It happened right in front of me as I was taking pictures. I think I was a "little" shocked at his actions, although I probably should have known better. Most of the local news media, TV and print, has pictured him as the low-key and moderate voice of gayness. He is not! Every time one of the security men tried to screen him out from disrupting the rally, every time he thought a person was thinking about touching him, he whimpered pathetically like a little girl and hollered for the police. BTW, the police saw nothing wrong with the way low-key security handled any situation. I must admit, I thought rally security was a little too much under wraps for me!
same sex marriages is very unpleasing to God they are trying to to change Gods law this not man made law this Gods law it is in the Bible maybe the people who is for prop 8 should read the Bible and then they will no what NO really mean.
RE: California Courts upholding California Proposition 8
"It's now an official part of our constitution. .." For the sake of clarity I am going to add the word California to "our constitution" because usually people think of the Constitution of the United States of America. Caifornia has quite a record in violating it. The loosing segment of prop . 8 still can fall back on the Supremacy Clause of the US constitution which might put the final word into the hands of the United Sates Supreme Court. The forefathers were very cognizant of the fact there are a lot of "Californias" in the world. Being fiscally prudent I won't take the bet about the less than 76 comments.
PS
Maybe I shall change my mind about the bet "less than 76 words" I have noticed that the topic is producing a lot of posts headed with female names, in probably feigned poor English.
They try to downplay the number of attendees in their head to make them feel like they are getting us to go on common ground with them. It won't work if we hold our ground on the matter. I have heard that they would like to pass ionto law that all Heterosexuals not ever be allowed to get a divorce no matter the cicumstances and that our marriages be nullified too. I am married in Gods eyes so it doesnt matter. They are going to do everything they can to try to get it changed so they can get married. The fight isnt over so stand strong.
It came up for a vote and for the second time the people spoke that marriage is between a man and a woman. Gods law is very clear on this. Leviticus 18:22, Lev 20:13, 1Corinthians 6 9-10. For thiose that are not Christian we would not be if not for God creating us and he only asks that we live by his word.
Hey Rich! How much was the ante?
I wonder if Jim Franklin is proud of himself. He put a lot of time and effort into keeping those people down boy. He can now lead his followers in rejoicing. They can all rejoice that they weren't born one of those people.
It is interesting to me that the Bible, a historical document, is constantly being referred to and yet other historical documents proving that the concept of marriage began as a secular institution before Jesus ever showed up and took it to another level, are ignored. As a Christian, I am not intimidated by the fact that history exists and we should learn from it. I was never taught to bury my head in the sand and ignore facts. It boggles me why this fact seems to be a threat to those here preaching the Christian ideal.
Vote the way you want to vote as many times as you have to. If the amount of effort and money generated by this topic were focused elsewhere, we could go a long way in solving some social problems much more pressing and beneficial to our state and country. I will vote to allow gay marriage. It doesn't hurt me in any way. God give us choice, let all citizens in this country have the same choices. God, not any of us, will be the final judge on our choices. I'm not sure how he will judge this one. I'll leave it to him.
Can we please have some other subjects....
Scot...are you proud of yourself? For what...marginalizing the will of God for his people?
Life style choices, Scot, life style choices!
I believe that most conservatives here would agree that we are able to choose our favorites. If you will let us then continue to do our own homework, likewise, we'll leave you to choose your favorite liberal lifeguards.
It is pretty clear how God will judge this in his word. He talks about it. As a Christian my hope is that everyone will vconfess their sins and change so they may have Eternal life
So many posts about how folks are married in the eyes of God, yet how many Christians get divorced? How many are adulterous? Maybe the eyes of their God blinks?
How do Christians who believe the Bible is the inerrant word of their God reconcile divorce or adultery in their lives and in the lives of their families and neighbors?
They don't really seem too, and yet, they are so passionate in their condemnation of gay people. According to the Bible, God demands stoning adulterers. And the Bible says God doesn't grant divorce. The 10 Commandments says plainly it is against God's Law to commit adultery. There is no mention of homosexuality and yet the Christians seem to think homosexuality is the gravest sin of all.
So it seems, gay couples, even gay couples with children do not deserve marriage but Christians can married and divorced and remarried as many times as they like.
What really turns my stomach are those grand pooh-bah right wing Christians like Newt Gingrich, an adulterer and divorcee many times over, speaking out against same sex marriage. There are so many others, too. All phoney in their piety.
May their God judge them with the same mercy and empathy they judge others!
F Drake
"What really turns my stomach are those grand pooh-bah right wing Christians ..."
F. Drake; because their (personal) God is their invention to alibi for the unchristian judging of fellow human beings. Without that implied backing of the highest authority (God) they would have to be ashamed of their anti-social thinking (the closest thing to persecution.) And that's my slant on it.
People who don’t read the Bible for themselves, but only quote what others say about the Bible, need to realize that what they hear from others may be a distortion. And the gay / adulterous / divorce crowd has many reasons to distort what the Bible says.
It’s important to read the Bible for yourself! It can’t hurt and you might be totally amazed at what it really says!
Yes, the Bible does talk about homosexuality - many of us have given the Biblical references - repeatedly in many other previous blogs.
And yes, the Bible regards adultery, incest, divorce, unmarried sex, homosexuality, etc., as "sins." All of these are a shame to our society. If they are present in our churches - and they certainly are - the church and society will suffer as a result - but the church is also the proper forum to talk about and offer forgiveness, change and transformation. (And God in His infinite mercy is always more than willing to forgive our sins and transform our lives).
If some "Christians seem to think homosexuality is the gravest sin of all" - they do so for good, sound theological reason - Romans 1:18-32; the context seems to suggest that homosexuality is the point where God says, "I will give them over to a depraved (or reprobate) mind." He says this three times in this portion of Scripture, as if He really wanted to emphasize this particular point. BTW, The Scripture quoted is not my words, but God’s! At any rate, all the above mentioned sins are forgivable - and many have found freedom from the bondage of these sins and now live transformed and radically changed lives!
We Christians dont think homosexuality is the gravest sin of all and know full well that God doesn't condone adultry or divorce. He has given all of us the choice to make choices and we will all be judged for our bad ones one day. God wants all of us to seek him and make good choices and confess our sins. He forgives and has already paid the price for us. This doesn't mean you confess and not change the way you live.
You mean Jesus paid the price for us right?
19 down, 57 to go.
Yes Jesus paid the price for us and it was huge debt to pay.
Homosexuality is not deranged, deviant, or immoral. God made man in his likeness, and, yes, this includes homosexuals. I believe that homosexuality is not a choice. Some people are straight, and some people are gay. If God did not want people to be homosexual, he would have made us all straight. God loves all people. Anyone who believes that homosexuality is unnatural needs to become educated about the subject; there is nothing more natural than two people, any two people, being in love. Stop hating gays, and start worrying about the real enemy; lack of universal health care. Renee
Renee...You use God to try to make your tortured point then sum it up that the lack of universal health care is the real enemy.According to the Bible(the word of God) the Devil and his minions are the real enemy.I believe the words inspired by the God of the Bible...not the bloggers of the Bee.
R. Wilson: As for your first line, if it is not why do homosexuals always have to make the point? Why is it even mentioned?
Because they stand in intersections and block traffic. Those are deranged (upsetting order), deviant (outside the norm), and immoral (wrong as opposed to right) acts. That conduct is as anti-social as one can get, it is the tactic of an anarchist who would rather see order fall than accept disappointment responsibly. They seek venues where success will result in furthering an image of persecution by inciting immediate disproportional reaction for the media to capture - registered vehicle vs. human provocateur.
To my knowlege that conduct had no equal when Obama won the election, and if you don't think his victory was a huge setback in the minds of many, then you are not politically in touch.
Renee....welcome. Thanks for your comments. Many here agree with you.
In an effort to remain in touch with reality, I wanted to understand the deranged, deviant and immoral people who would stop traffic to make a point. It appears there a a huge number of bizarre gay people stopping traffic all over the United States. I searched newspapers for demonstrations resulting in blocked intersections and traffic snarls as the same sex marriage crowd. Did you know that thousands of the groups listed below are all bizarro anarchists?
Antiwar demonstrators
Pro-life demonstrators
Anti-genetics research protestors
High school students demonstrating education cuts
Group for immigration reform
One group wants us to leave Iraq!
Las Vegas pedestrians demonstrating the death of man in a crosswalk
Free Sri Lanka demonstrators (O.K.)
Does that mean they are all gay too?
Did you know this behavior has occurred since Obama came on the scene? Gee and I thought the riots in the sixties and eighties were bad... well to my knowledge at least.
A news item I ran across the other day: "A publication from the American Psychological Association includes an admission that there is no 'gay' gene, according to a doctor who has written about the issue on the website of National Association for Research & Therapy of Homosexuality. Dean Byrd, the past president of NARTH, confirmed that the statement from the American Psychological Association .... (different from) what the APA has advocated for years."
".... the APA's position changed. The new statement says: ....There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. .... it is clear that efforts to 'prove' that homosexuality is simply a biological fait accompli have failed...."
Amazing .... even LIB organizations are now conceding that there is no "gay" gene .... that homosexuals are not born "that way." The activist researchers themselves have RELUCTANTLY reached the conclusion: There is no gay gene.
Life style choices, life style choices!
"I wanted to understand the deranged, deviant and immoral people who would stop traffic to make a point."
If my memory serves me correctly, these are the same ones who "marry in intersections". I am not in touch with reality on that one yet. I can't take on any more at this point. For me , all that reality is too unreal.
TC, NARTH is no "LIB organization." It is a bunch of religious doctors who take money to counsel gay people who don't want to be gay. It should come as no surprise to anyone that there are some who don't like the fact that they are gay so they seek counsel. In many cases their parents seek counsel for them. I've poured over the NARTH website and I've sent the link to many people I know. It's very clear what they are and what their agenda is.
It's no surprise to me that you and others like you buy into it. It's just what you want to believe and that's ok, there's no shame in that. The bottom line is, you're not gay and have no idea what it's like. Please don't pretend you do.
Scot...following your thought process,then your not gay either and have no idea what it is like...correct? Not that you stated this but I object to the notion that because I am against homosexual marriage that I dislike homosexuals.I have homosexual friends(not the parade type) whom I get along with quite well.
Well Brian my comment wasn't directed at you because you didn't try to portray the NARTH organization as a liberal-knows-everything-about-gays organization. I thought I should correct TC so he wouldn't have the wrong impression.
Also, it was never my intention to accuse anyone (and I don't think I did) of disliking homosexuals because they don't agree.
You might find this surprising but of all the gays and lesbians I know, and there are a lot, none of them are the "parade type," although I do enjoy the Dykes on Bikes who usually lead the parade in West Hollywood. Imagine nothing but girls on a hundred Harleys rumbling by. Some of the most fantastic bikes you'll ever see. And many of the girls are cute. Some are a little scary but hey.
Anyway, in the sense that only gays know exactly what it's like to be gay, you're right, I don't. But in the sense of being around them so much and talking to them and learning about them, coupled with a brother who is 13 months apart from me and like a twin, I know a lot.
I would suggest you find out more from the friends you have. They'll be happy to answer any reasonable respectful questions you have...I promise. If they see you're sincere, they'll open up. My favorite question: When did you first realize you were gay? Some of the answers may surprise you.