Is the head punch a move they teach in the academy?

I suppose you could argue that this is a result of having those MMA events at Woodward Park. Now the cops are acting like cage fighters.

Mmmmmmm....knuckle sammich.

Homeless? Where did that come from? The guy was a known, wanted a-hole who resisted arrest.

Sorry, no tea and sympathy.

I don't know what happened prior to the clip, but it doesn't look like the guy's resisting a whole lot of anything to me.

Ahhhh.... Equilibrium! I guess the movie wasn't that far off after all. LOL, look at the way the cars are changing, their bikes are changing, their outfits and persona are changing, their perception within the community is changing, and their wrestling abilities are changing...

The head punch is the second rule of of combat taught in the academy, the gun is the first!

He wouldnt put his hands behind his back you can clearly see , ever try wrestling youre little kids when dressing them we'll imagine wrestling a un-bathed 200lb baby god bless the fresno pd for putting up with such nonsense.

@chase: he was cuffed already. he was not wanted, just had a criminal past. no justification for excessive force. dyer fubared himself in that interview.

chase,
where are you getting that he was wanted by the police? neither the ksee 24 story nor the bee story say that. and just because someone is wanted do we allow the police to do whatever they want? no. by that logic, the police could just shoot everyone that is a "wanted a-hole."

and resisting? where are the facts that support that? the police didn't take any witness statements of the event. so all we have is the police officers' own statements. hmmm, guys caught on tape beating a man say that he was "stiff." well, punch away. an officer was punched in the arm and a badge was wripped off. so, an intoxicated stiff man punched and officer. must of be some assault to justify repeatedly striking a man who is being restrained. and, it must really justify punching a man in the back of the head who is almost in cuffs or already in cuffs.

you know, the police in oakland said almost the exact same thing about the guy that they punched in the face while in cuffs, and later executed at the bart station.

perhaps now fresno will finally fund a police auditor.

@ Chase - I hope someday that a cop beats on you a bit, that way you can know how that guy felt. Homeless or not, resisting or not, what gives anyone the right to treat someone like that? That last punch (where they had him restrained) could have done some serious damage when his face was being driven into the ground. (Think American History X, and a 'boot party')

The problem is this: Evidently the police here have been getting away with things for so long, they feel like they are above prosecution. I'm personally calling on Chief Dyer to get his act in gear. Why isn't anybody asking for his job? It's obvious there has been a breakdown in the chain of command.

I want to share two stories that I have personal knowledge of, concerning the Fresno police. This isn't here-say, this is truth, as witnessed by me.

My first story concerns what must have been a 75 year old lady, stopped one night by the FPD. It appeared to me that it was a routine traffic stop. She never exited her vehicle, but 5 minutes after the stop, there were 7 police cars there, some of them waving guns at this "grandma".

I'm not real sure what the lady had done, and I'm not sure that she had really done anything, but they hauled her out of the car, and slammed her in the back of the police car, seemingly unaware that she was old enough to break a hip tripping over a toothpick.

Now obviously she must've done something, perhaps it was driving while Michael Phelpsed, who knows, but seriously? 7 cars to stop one grandma? Seems a little excessive to me....

My second story is this:

before i decided to move here, I came out to Fresno last year for a visit. I had been having a good time up until this point, the people here seemed friendly, the Tower district was my kind of area, and I was a big fan of the no rain. In Oklahoma (where I am from) it had rained for 33 straight days right before I came to Fresno, so I was excited to dry out.

All that changed one night after a visit to A-1 Liquor.

I had walked down to get a bottle of crown, a bag of chips and a coke. It was two and a half blocks away, and on my way down there I saw two police cars sitting in an empty parking lot, no big deal. On the way back, they had a kid sitting on the curb. I took a look at him, and was continuing down the street so that I could crack my bottle. I was thirsty.

That's when they stopped me. At first, they asked me to stop. That's not a problem, I stopped and asked them what was going on. They told me "that there had been some robberies in the area (I guess because Brown & Maroa is real dangerous, but it was most likely so they could just randomly stop people) and asked if they could see my ID.

This is where I started having the problem. I obviously didn't have any stolen property on me. I had already shown them what was in my bag, they knew that I wasn't who they were looking for. I also told them I wasn't from Fresno, and that I hadn't been stealing anything, that I had only been in town for a few weeks.

The officer who stopped me told me that if I didn't give him my ID, I would be sitting in the back of the car. I'm 34, and no my rights. Not only is this wrong, but it's also an illegal search. But wait, the story gets better.

I gave the officer my ID (I had nothing to hide) and he asked me to sit on the curb next to the kid they had already stopped. I asked the kid why he was sitting there, and he told me that he had been walking home from work when the cops stopped him, and that they had searched him and found his stash of pot (which he claimed was only a bowl or so) and that he was sitting there waiting on the ticket he was going to get. I asked him how long he had been sitting there and he said about 5 minutes now. What really got me is that neither cop seemed like they were too interested in writing this guy his ticket.

One of the cops was running my ID, while the other one was scanning the streets, just in time to see a guy riding by on his bicycle, so that he had time to step into the street and tackle the guy on the bike. I'm not real sure what he had done ( I was pretty sure that riding your bike isn't a crime) but they started roughing him up a little, then cuffed him and threw him in the back of the car.

The cop (now I wanted to call them pigs) that was running my ID came over and said that he needed me to sit on the curb for a few more minutes while he got some things straightened out. At this point I had been sitting there for about 15 minutes (of my own will) and I had had enough. I told him that he was going to give me my ID, and that unless he was arresting me, I was heading back to my friends house. He then walked up to me, eyeballed me real hard, and asked me what gang I was affiliated with.

By this point, I was in no mood to play, but I calmly asked him what he was talking about. He said "Lucky Thirteen, on your shirt. Is that some sort of gang thing?" I laughed at him, and told him that it was a clothing company that catered to motorcyclists. I told him that I wasn't in a gang, and I turned to leave. He stopped me (with his hand grabbing my shirt) and turned and looked at the other cop, who nodded his head. The cop who had a hold of my shirt then turned to me and said "You are free to go."

I walked back to my friends house, sat down on the porch, and poured myself a drink.

I don't like the cops here. It seems to me that there are way too many, and that they have nothing better to do than harass people that are just out trying to make it in this world. I've read about a few police shootings where the guy wasn't even armed, and have seen all kinds of cops stopping people for no apparent reason. It seems as though it takes at least 3 cops to write a ticket, maybe even more.

Now they are stealing cars and beating homeless. I'm not surprised. What I am surprised of is this; Why the people of Fresno continue to put up with this. The Chief is an elected official is he not? He works for the people of Fresno does he not? Then why should the people of Fresno have to be subjected to such corruption? They want to moan about prison overcrowding, and yet I am left wondering how many of them are there because of an illegal search and seizure?

anyway just my $.02. I wanted to write something about it last night when I saw the news story, I'm glad I got to say something about it today. Thanks Fresno BeeHive.

Oh yeah, and before you say "Why did you move here if you hate the cops so much?" know that it is because I am not a criminal, I know my rights, and I'm not afraid of the police (beating me or not). Fresno is a great town, the arts community here is wonderful (which is why I decided to stay, I'm an artist), and the people with whom I associate are great.

Let's see......wanted on a felony warrant.....had a prior for hitting an S.O. deputy....

Absolutely agree about the "auditor", btw. That's been a no-brainer for years. Even Dyer has no problem with it.

But I'll withhold any further opinion....until Katie Couric and Warren Paboojian have a say.

10 years ago I was celebrating a job promotion.
I was at a local bar and ready to leave so I went outside with friends to hail a cab.
The cab turned out to be a police car and when they realized what we wanted, rather than let us go, they began to cite us for drunk in public, in front of the bar.
We were obviously drunk. in public. but ready to responsibly go home.
I of course started mouthing off which is legal but I wasnt the one wearing the badge.
I got hand-cuffed. In front of my friends.
Smarted off some more and thats when he horror started.
Those of you who know me, know what I look like.
First the officer started groping me. Remember, I was handcuffed. He was groping, not checking for anything illegal. There are no pockets on the front of a tank top.
When I pulled away, he pushed me down to the ground. Imagine falling to the ground without your hands to break your fall.
When I tried to get up he pushed my face into the concrete.
My friends were all yelling for him to stop because I was already handcuffed.
Apparently he called for back up and a paddy-wagon came with two more officers.
By that time I was crying and telling him he was hurting me.
My cries only seemed to infuriate him more.
The two other officers started roughing me up pretty badly; all of this in front my friends who were pretty much helpless.
By the time I went to the jail I was bruised from head to toe, bleeding, clothing torn and handcuffed and shackled.
Again, those of you who know me, know I'm not the largest girl out there.
Within the three hours I was in custody, an astonished correctional officer had taken pictures of my injuries and called an attorney who came out to see if I wanted to press charges against the Fresno Sheriff Dept.
My father was a sheriff at the time so I couldnt even imagine going through that or putting him through that.

This type of brutality has been going on for a long long time.
I wish now that I would've spoken up then. It was horrible experience and watching that video brought back many horrible memories.
The names and faces of the officers who did that to me will forever be engrained in my brain.
I recieved a letter of apology a week later and my drunk in public charge was dropped; erased from existance.
That letter doesnt erase those memories.
Fresno law enforcement is a joke.

this starts at the top. Chief Dyer, the biggest gangsta in Fresno.

i do applaud their no holds barred assault on fresno gang members because, lets face it, they are the scum of the earth. unfortunately, this aggressiveness seems to be occuring while not dealing with gangbangers.

the situation that happened to Chris above (who by the way i want to say welcome, he's been posting some good stuff lately) is something that shouldn't happen period.

@ Mdub - thanks for the welcome! Hope to see you out one of these days, I'll buy you a drink.

chase,
maybe i'm not seeing it (or hearing it). where are you getting wanted on a felony warrant?

I did read that he has a prior conviction for assault of an officer.

I read it (and saw it)HERE, although the chief is the one saying it, and I am wondering how credible he is.

I want to know why the police didn't bother getting any eye-witness accounts for their report?

thanks chris,
the first video that ksee had (the one linked @ the top) didn't mention that he was eventually arrested for a felony warrant, and the bee articles didn't mention it either.

@MikeOz dont give mayor ashley ideas regarding the MMA events in woodward.

What is shown in this video is really a tredgedy. The most tradgic thing is that this is a common experience for the thousands of homeless individuals in Fresno. I've heard stories about people waking up to being kicked by police officers. Another story comes from a formerly homeless friend who was crossing a vacant lot. A police office pulled a gun on him because he was "trespassing".

These and other similar stories led me to push for our "Ten Year Plan to End Chronic Homelessness" to address these issues. Below is some text that I built consensus amoung the Planning Council tasked with writting the 10 Year Plan. Unfortunately, by the request of the Mayor's office (Autry administration) this text along with other policy statements and action items written by myself and other Planning Council members were ommitted by the consultant compiling our plan.

Action: Foster healthy relationships between Law Enforcement, Sanitation, other agencies, and the homeless. Encourage and provide special training when necessary for: conflict resolution, outreach, and cooperation.

Action: Educate the homeless about the roles and responsibilities of those agencies. Clearly communicate the obligations and what is expected of homeless individuals as city and county citizens.

The result is a "draft" plan that was unanimously adopted by the City and County. However, the plan has no teeth to really be effective. As evidenced by the video, nothing has changed. It is paramount that we change the way our community is policed.

something is going on with all the cops in fresno lately, theyve been out of control
giving tickets for DUI's when people dont even drink, j walking tickets, etc,
these guys are out of hand even Im afriad to even drive sober
guess that what happens when the state is broke and you need to make some quick cash for your employer somehow

The Fresno PD is one of the scariest police departments in California. They've forgotten who they work for (us, the tax paying citizens) and they've formed their own renegade gang. Despite economic crisis, they continue to keep the chopper in the air and they continue buying new Dodges and BMWs. Since preventing and solving REAL crimes doesn't pay, they have resorted to extorting motorists with hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of chicken sh*t citations. And with no real oversight or accountability, they are free to beat, steal, and terrorize. I'm afraid that this video only represents a fragment of the blatant lawlessness with our Fresno PD.

whatever he did still wasnt called for
i hate all dept. CHP, FRESNO, Sheriff they all do the same s*** they will get away with it
i would want to know what lawyer is picking up this case :)

LOL, I was accosted by a S.O. in the Tower district back in November. I actually wrote about it because I was so upset. I was thinking in my head, "Does Mr. Incognito have to slap an S.O."?

Look, we can sit here and talk about what works and what doesn't work in regard to this; the issue still stands that some not all but some cops look for opportunities to usurp their (as Eric Cartman would say, "Authority)!

Times have changed, people no longer want to shake hands and talk with the police. Once again, I'm sure this Chris Brown beat down isn't an isolated incident, this one just happened to be caught!

@The Suppressors - the oversight exists because someone is getting a kick back from it. You're absolutely correct in your assessment of new "toys". LOL, it takes money to keep buying "toys", just don't get pulled over and make a contribution to the Fresno PD buying fund (a ticket).

@anna - hate is so strong, it will take you to the Dark Side... (LOL)

The nice thing, as I point out in the article on my blog today, is that the one-two punch (oops, did I really say that?) the Fresno PD has received of late seems to be converting Jerry Dyer into a "let's-not-rush-to-judgment" guy.

Some good may come of this yet!

I noticed a couple of things on this.

First: Regarding Joey's Story.
Nobody commented. (like, I didn't see one comment, maybe I missed it.)
Personally? That story really upset me.
-For a lot of reasons:
Getting felt up and beat up because you're a drunk mexican female is wrong (by a cop, by a civilian, by anyone.)

What upsets me about the story, (and I need to watch how I say this, or it could come out wrong.) Is: there was so much 'backstory influence' to it, that really prevented justice from being done.
-Can you arrest a group of people for being (publically) drunk, -when they are (drunk in public) trying to hail a cab? Yeah, I guess so, but that's kind of pushing it.
--The rest of it?
(IF) this was to be an arrest, it should have been handled much cleaner than that. (IF)
--the rest of it is horrific.
(BUT) --and here's where the web grows thick.
-Something so awful happens, --and no charges are pressed (why?) -well, there were other levels of family involvement (which makes sense, she didn't want the issue to affect a close relative.)

-But looking at this (whole thing)
--what dictated (and decided/prevented) justice was a 'side relationship.'
---And that gets in the way of a lot of policework, --and is what has (most) people so cynical and distrusting of interracting with police (and) civiiians.
I've been on both sides of it, (personally) where you know something wrong is going on, --but you can't do anything (and you know nothing will be done,) because somebody 'knows somebody' --and that's been with (both) looking to press charges or see someone brought to justice, (or) feeling helpless against a blue wall of silence and indifference.
-The end result is: you don't believe in right and wrong as being really right and wrong anymore, the layers of relationship demolish justice, (and that's a bad crazy day.)

I wind up doing a lot of work with the cops in my neighborhood, because I live in a sucky neighborhood.
They've been great to work with.
-For the most part?
the cops I've dealt with here in Fresno have been okay-by-me... (I say that not to 'counter' the bad stories, I have no doubt they happen, -and recently ran into some confusion (surrounding a non-violent crime committed towards me,) where I almost found myself with a cop who was, well, just 'testy,' ---but it all worked out.

I do not think that all people are treated equally here in Fresno.

I think there is a bias that I have benefitted from (being white) that I've seen others (not) benefit from.
I think people of color are automatically assumed to be 'trouble' sometimes, depending on the situation, --and find that really reprehensable, (such as the extreme situation of what happened to Joey.

Having said that: (and considering the videos)
-having been trained (back in the day) on how to take people into custody or 'immobilize' them.

I have to ask the following:

--Are officers (or any public servants) allowed to 'counter-strike' with a fist, a person?
(I recall specific training on working with (even) batons) and such, --but these were to be used only if attacked, and a series of holds was always employed (rather than) hitting a suspect/perp.

--Are officers in california allowed to 'punch' an individual in the head? (repeatedly if at all?)

--Are officers in california allowed to 'punch' an individual in the head while they are partially (or) fully restrained?

--Are officers in california allowed to 'punch' an individual in the head (or anywhere) once they have been completely handcuffed (even if person is struggling (in this case I didn't see much struggle.

See, a lot of holds can be executed, some that are pretty brutal and graphic, --that will get results from the individual being worked with, ---but if they're inhibriated or high they may not feel pain, (so even there, they could wind up damaged in the holds) --but hitting with a fist (unless you're looking to knock them unconcious,
(which) you don't do with a fist (nor do at all,)
would be the only way to immobilize (full quiet) such a person,
---else you're looking at more officers and eventually putting holdson the individual (rather than striking.)
-that he had his badge ripped, that they were trying to 'poke' the officer with it, -that he 'hit' the officer? --ALL that can be handled by 'restraining holds'

I am not aware of hitting with fists being effective in dealing with any this, however.

waiting for the light $$$$
mr.

i have ONE word for you all

STEROIDS

wonder what % would come up dirty if the entire department was tested?

This is the 3rd most popular story on cnn.com right now. As if Fresno does not have enough to deal with as far as its reputation goes. This story is sickening on so many levels. Of course, the story itself. I don't care if it is Charlie Manson himself, once you have him cuffed and and on the ground, there is no need to add one last sucker punch to the face. To me, that is pure cowardice. I am ashamed of our police department. There are always a few bad apples, but in our case, there seems to a few too many in the bunch. (chop shop, DUI stings, after hour drinking binges and then driving themselves) I was on the Clovis Bank Robbery/Fresno St. Shootout Jury last year. And while the defendants were guilty as all get out, and we found them as such, what I found surprising was that the media never really reported that two neighborhood detectives decided upon themselves to set up behind their truck (around teh campus) and fire numerous shots at the suspect's vehicle as they fled. Might I add, that they failed to hit the suspect's car even once even though they had a fairly good shot at it (may have something to say about their expertise when discharging a firearm me thinks). Point being, there seems to be no real set of rules in this department. Clients of mine have spoken of their boyfriends who are Fresno Police who brag about driving down people and beating them. Perhaps exaggeration, but if I had to guess, I would guess no. In my opinion, the reins have become too loose over the years, and once you do that, even nice dogs become wild. The one to blame ultimately is the handler. Dyer. He needs to go. He may mean well, but there are many out there who mean well, but also have the ability to control their employees in a much better fashion then Dyer has over the years. Fresno is better than this.

Another quick comment. WetTowel asked in one of his previous posts why nobody commented upon Ms Joey's experience. My guess is that is because these posts are relayed in bunches. Meaning, that sometimes we comment upon things without having the ability to read previous entries until hours later. It would be nice if this were a live blog. If anything crazy or obscene is said, it could always be edited out later.. That being said, for the sake of being a nitpicker... "Getting felt up and beat up because you're a drunk mexican female is wrong".. How about being felt up, or mishandled, or beaten despite one's race, level of sobriety, gender, side of town, or time of evening is wrong? I know you meant well, but let us not diminish the issue with such specifics. Being treated like an animal is wrong, regardless, and that is a lesson that needs to be taught to the FPD.

Repeatedably questionable cops?! A good reason for our having the FBI. Perhaps this is a good time for one of their investigations. At least they have maintained their professional standards.

There are good cops. There are bad cops.

Punching is an acceptable form of restraint (unfortunately). Usually it's a pain-compliance punch to the upper thigh, but in this case it was to the face. Was it excessive? Eh, I'm not a lawyer or cop, but it was certainly quite rude (ie, yeah, that last punch? Unnecessary). These cops were/are poorly trained.

I once rode along with a cop who spotted a 'suspicious' driver. The cop was parked, so he pulled out, sped up, and pointed his radar detector at the side of the road and logged in 72mph, the cop's speed. When he pulled the guy over, sure enough he says "I've got you locked at 72mph on my radar." Okay, sure, the guy was dui, but still. Cheatin' street enforcement.

There are good cops, and bad cops. Either way, we sure do want them streaming to our aid when we're affronted (If it had been a citizen groping MsJoey, she'd have wanted the cops there toot sweet). However, MsJoey could have been handled a LOT better, attitude or no. 'Drunk in Public' is so friggin' misused. I've seen a cop ask someone nicely to step outside to talk, and then arrest the guy for drunk in public!

There are good cops and bad cops.

Chief Dyer does what he can with both the good and the bad cops. It's not like he has three 'Precogs' in a swimming pool to tell him who is stealing cars and who is beating homeless dudes. He has to be reactive to most of these situations.

What he CAN control is the revenue enhancement through traffic enforcement, sobriety checkpoints that are really fund-raising towing points for (mostly) minorities without proper paperwork, and the maturation level of officers.

My cuz is a good cop. He and his partner are tasked with pulling over speeders and giving tickets during rush hour in the morning and afternoon. They patrol the streets. They actively pursue neglectful drivers. They pull over school zone speeders. But my cuz's partner says "I am NOT pulling over some guy who's out there trying to not be late, who's busting his butt working for his family."

Chief Dyer and the CHP seem to disagree with that statement.

Unfortunately, all of my encounters with cops harassing me has been mostly professional. When they become dicks, I shut the heck up. Cuz I know they base pretty much every case they deal with on the person's attitude. MsJoey learned the very unfortunate way what jerks they can be...and I do wish she'd have filed a formal complaint. She's too damn lovely to ever be bruised by anyone. Too bad the SCRG weren't there to have your back...it would have been a riot (both uses of the term).

Michael:
-good points to say.
-Regarding the comment about 'being felt up and beat up because you're a drunk Mexican Female is wrong.'
is founded upon (2) unsaids/assumed factors (get them straight.

-YES: anyone being felt up, and beaten up (be they any race, gender or condition of sobriety is wrong, --by ANYONE.) -duh-

-YES: I am saying: the reason WHY she was Beat up and Felt up? probably had a lot to do with the (disgusting) thought (that a lot of people have) that it's okay (meaning 'less wrong-you can get away with it.' --because she was drunk, and latina.
--Same stunt pulled up in a nicer section of town outside of a well-to-do eatery to a (well-to-do) white woman?
-ARE YOU KIDDING?-

This town has a clear double standard of who gets what rights afforded,
who gets what 'patience' and the 'desire for fair treatment,'
-and (whites) -specifically whites from mid-to upper class?
-are treated better.

My gut (on this with the beating, and with the misstreatment of Joey) is they figured
'...We can do this to this person,
and they are not of the type of society (here in Fresno) that anyone is going to really care about
(nor)
who are affiliated with anyone who has any real credibility.
--If they knew of Joey's familial ties with the authorities in the area?
I can assure you they would have not acted the same way.
(Which, though it would have spared her the humiliation,(and crime committed against her person, which, check me on this, was sexual assault.)

It STILL would have been 'better treatment:
(but for the WRONG reasons,
-it would have been because she was an officer's daughter (not)
because she was a human being deserving of respectful treatment in an arrest.
---BIG DIFFERENCE--

Fair Treatment by the law is based upon a universal (FAIR TREATMENT (period) IT IS OUTSIDE THE COMMON THOUGHT, PREJUDICE, AND PRIVATE INTERPRETATION OF ANY ACTOR (BE THEY POLICE OR PERP.)

---it's not a 'situation based' nor
'who they related to/good ol' boy, let'm go'
nor
'piece of human trash floating too far North, 'BUM'
-Based issue.

Similar disgust (in my eyes?)

'...Great, Another thing Fresno is known (nationally) to be 'wrong' and 'picked on' for 'making us look worse...'

Dude: Are you Serious?
adjust your sights.
WILL YOU GET THE HELL OFF OF 'LOOKS' ('...aw man, that makes us LOOK bad...')
---No, this IS bad... (not LOOKS) bad.

Looks are horseshit.
Who CARES what Fresno 'looks' like?

Looks are what you're lookin' at, --and then when folks look away, (or so long as it 'looks good') -stuff is just 'ducky.'
---That's a huge part of this mess too.
-It was 'making it look good, keeping up good apperances (this individual 'clashes' with the immed. neighborhood, 'treat 'em how you want nobody's LOOKING.)

FRESNO: GET OVER YOUR LOOKS.

-Cause most of this stuff is (usually done) in the dark, when nobody can really see... It's become so commonplace that now it's done in the light, ---and people are like '..If I don't look, and I don't see? then it's not a problem.'

HUGE problem here (HUGE)
'---just make it look good, please, just elevate our status out of 'common punchline...'

To a great extent? Public servants perform to what is wanted of them, and they know what the public tolerates, expects, and really doesn't care about.

I strongly believe that if this were not a homeless person, (and in Joey's story) not a latina?
(inhibriated, yes, but there is no way I'm going to hear what I've heard in this town about Mexicans for the past three years and believe her race did not play a factor...)
---It would have gone a different way.

And Fresno's been building that cradle (and grave) for years.
-That others are now seeing it, videoing it, and it's become the subject of conversation by anyone who has eyes and half a brain?

-Merely chickens come home to roost.

The answer is not '...make this go away, make us look better.'

towel,
careful, keep up that chickens coming home to roost talk and someone might try and put you on a jeremiah wrigth-esque rail out of town.

even if it's true (or has kernal of truth).

Mr. Crist, letter to the editor Feb 12th,

Why get rid of Dyer? If you listen to Rick Berman, all of the cops in Fresno regularly go around beating up poor defenseless homeless people for the heck of it. Thank God it was finally caught on video. Let's scrap the whole department and let Mr. Berman sort it all out.

I doubt Mr. Berman has ever been in a patrol car and responded to complaints about the passed out, intoxicated people, the panhandlers on the center dividers, and those that throw bottles into traffic to get people to stop so they can solicit them. He would rather sit in the comfort of his own office, entertain some partial truth, and throw his ambulance-chasing conclusions out to alarm the public about dangerous all those enforcing the law are to them personally.

I applaud those of you that want to feed the needy, but a good majority of those folks on the medians are alcoholics, have mental illness, are carrying weapons and are easily agitated when contacted by police. They don't want to be removed from there "spots" where they gather enough coin to buy the next drink or the next fix. They then go pass out somewhere, and police are called to check on their welfare.

When police arrive to "check their welfare," more often than not, they awaken an intoxicated, mentally ill and armed or combative person who does not want to go to jail because he is unable to care for his own safety.

There are plenty of resources available to persons who are truly hungry. A majority of those persons complained about as being aggressive, refuse those services because they don't want to follow rules at those establishments that want to help them. They stay out on the center divider and endanger you and I because they want to be intoxicated, or use drugs and you continue to enable them by giving them money. You complain and the cops are left to deal with the results of your kindness.

It seems like stories like this create an atmosphere for people to pile on the PD. I like the majority of people on this post agree that what the PD did seems to be wrong and excessive. However to say that all cops are bad and that Fresno PD is the worst in the state is just plain naive. Go to LA or Oakland and you will see the same kinds of things. Again just like any industry there are good and bad. As for someone who has lived in Fresno almost my entire life(and really likes this town), not too long ago the crime was getting out of control and I appreciate the efforts being made for a safer City. I do not appreciate abuse of power or harassment by law enforcement but by the same token the fact that hundreds of idiots still drive drunk-carry weapons and do whatever they want and break the law, I think the FPD does a pretty good job. They are not all bad! Talk to someone who had been on the other end as victims and they might tell another story! I am glad this video was exposed to the public and I hope justice is served...

i don't ever give panhandlers any money at all. i need that extra change for my own alcohol.

'wearinblu' is right. If someone needs to be removed from the center divider, then handcuffing them and punching them in the face is totally the right way to do it! Bravo!

wearinblu: How does any of what you said, justify an attack on a restrained person?
The video is blatant and obvious to anyone watching it and any justification otherwise is a slap in the face to anyone with clear vision.
Shame on you.

So i guess they are launching an internal investigation? Right, nothing is sweeter that some cops investigating other cops.

What is that going to prove?

With the recent tarnishing of the FPD, how can anybody trust an internal investigation?

The sad thing is that I heard that an independent investigation can't be done because the city of Fresno can't afford one.

Here's my solution to that: Start laying off cops. Force them to have a mandatory leave like they are doing with the rest of the state workers... That should garner some money fairly fast. It seems like the governator thinks it will anyway...

sorry, couldn't help myself. But this is the last time I am going to say anything about the cops here in Fresno. I don't want them beating me next time they see me.

Ed:
-Talking about the reality of society, and it's problems? is part of a pastor's, public servants, practitioner, artists, nurses, (etc.)
(pretty much anything with a spine's)
job.

Feel free to chime in.
You know, when you're not busy throwing up alternative stances searching for debate.

(and thanks for the warning btw... how do we take that, exactly?)

(For the record)

I've professionally, in uniform, had to respond to and deal with plenty of people with mental illness, even those who were stoned (and/or) intoxicated and and violent, (they're often classified as MICA (mentally ill, chemically addicted.) And they're a significant degree of the homeless population.
(It's pretty standard when dealing with the homeless, mentally ill, and public in general.)

You deal with this every day as an officer, as a counsellor, outreach worker (etc,) --and you work the problem in ways that do not 'exascerbate' the situation into violence.

What's so weird in this situation? (and really accentuates how screwed up this situation is?)

When any police or security force (any human services group) KNOWS or SUSPECTS that they're dealing with people who are emotionally ill?,
(or) under the influence (and possibly armed,)
--they normally take extra precautions to work with them, not get them riled, and 'contain' them as safely (for the individual (and) themselves as cleanly and as quickly as possible...

-Once a person who is under the influence of anything starts to go off? They can be a runaway train that feels almost nothing, and are very hard to calm down.

-Anyone working with the public is trained (or should be trained) in verbal communication skills to keep this person calm, and, -If they're unreachable?
there are holds and takedown methods that,
though they may look 'extreme,'
--actually are least traumatizing to the individual (and quite effective.)

Punching somebody in the head?
(once or repeatedly)
is NOT an acceptable method on any force that I've ever worked on, with, or have heard of.
SOMEHOW that simple fact keeps being missed.

All the rest of it?
Yep, cops have a horrendously difficult job.
Especially here in Fresno,
(....but, you know,
I don't want to say stuff that makes Fresno
'look bad,' --so just say that there are an excessive amount of small children lost on their way to school in need of direction...

There are definite 'hell-hole' aspects to this place that are legit, and a strong presence IS required.

But there are correct and incorrect ways to do this.
This example (and the ones listed, if accurate?)
are incorrect.

Putting on (any) uniform?, you know (and are trained) going in, how to conduct yourself appropriately.

This failure to do so was caught on video.

In any situation, the minute you let the behavior of those you are dealing with (dictate/degenerate) your own methods and training?
You are at their mercy, they have won, and you are worse than them.

I still feel that this individual was treated this way because the police figured:

1. Nobody is going to care about how we treat a homeless guy (including pounding him in the head) --and

2. It will send a strong message to (other) homeless in the area: 'Stay DownTown.'

(I also think there are plenty of silent responses (some thinly veiled on the string) thinking:
'...good, they're cleaning the streets and medians around here... 'bout damn time.')

@ wearinblu - take away the fact the guy was homeless. Now ignoring his prior record (that the officers couldn't have known, unless they were familiar with this guy) and his apparent 'intoxication' (and for the record, police have a funny way of claiming that you are intoxicated. 'well i smelled alcohol on his breath') then what do you have? A human being. It shouldn't matter what his mental state was, it shouldn't matter that he was homeless. The fact is, his rights were violated when they started using his head as a speed bag.

The police here feel that they can treat people however they want. Go read my earlier post about how I was treated as a visitor to this city. Now, I'm not saying that all cops in this town are crooked. I just haven't had the occasion to meet one that isn't.

I know that I said that I wouldn't post anymore about this, and believe me I really don't want to. But I think that the people of Fresno need to know what is going on with their police department. Perhaps they need some kind of oversight committee or something, maybe it's time for some questions to be answered, and not just a press release or the Chief getting on TV, saying that they are launching an internal investigation.

It's surprising to me that there isn't more of a public outrage of this, and the other things that have surfaced about the FPD in the past few weeks. As hard as people protested Prop 8, you would think that the same kind of fervor could be applied in this case.

Or is that the police has everyone scared to step up and say something?

Remember, bruises and breaks heal, but living in a state of terror is everlasting.

i know I'm not ever talking with another police officer in this town without a video camera present.

towel,
i'm not sure, i think you might have missed the wittiness to what i was trying to say. i suppose i should've put the ;) at the end.

Do 2 wrongs make a right?
How about 3 or 4 wrongs?
The video is shocking, and in my opinion shows the police using unnecessary force, but because this guy had a prior arrest that makes it ok?
He may have been homeless at the time, but I guarantee there are lawyers whispering in his ear now, and he probably won’t be homeless for long. So after a lawsuit, then everything will be set right?

Yeah, there probably should be an investigation into this whole incident, and the result will probably be disciplinary actions, or firing of at least the primary officer doing the hitting. So does that make everything right?

What happens when our crime rate increases and they release 57,000 inmates back into society? We’re going to have a public that distrusts the police, a high crime rate that is only going to increase and an economy that’s in the toilet.

Does that make it right then?

...nah, Ed,
it just wasn't witty,

-but thanks for phonin' in.
(blink-blink)

@Chris: I think you've got it there...everyone is too scared of the cops to do anything about it. I'm pretty outspoken when it comes to civil liberties, corrupt officials and bad government. But am I going to go out and protest the Fresno PD? F* no. I'd be worried I'd be turned into the next punching bag. I can hopefully say this with as little bias as possible, I was a cadet w/ the sheriffs dept all through high school and actually went to the police academy (hard to believe if you know me, I know). I eventually turned down my job offer with the S.O. because I know how corrupt a lot of these guys are. And I don't just mean when dealing with the public, but dealing with each other. Any time a sergeants promotion came around, all the candidates would be doing everything they could to make their fellow officers (competitors) look bad. Including falsifying reports and delaying response times. Come on, this is public safety were talking about and they want to sacrifice that to get some gold chevrons on their collar and a pay raise?

Oh, and since I know many of us like to take in some adult beverages at our fine local establishments, it probably wouldn't hurt to share PC 647(f) with you all...this is the "drunk in public" law:

Who is found in any public place under the influence of intoxicating liquor, any drug, controlled substance, toluene, or any combination of any intoxicating liquor, drug, controlled substance, or toluene, in a condition that he or she is unable to exercise care for his or her own safety or the safety of others, or by reason of his or her being under the influence of intoxicating liquor, any drug, controlled substance, toluene, or any combination of any intoxicating liquor, drug, or toluene, interferes with or obstructs or prevents the free use of any street, sidewalk, or other public way.

That means, hailing a cab, unless you were blocking traffic, would (should) be totally acceptable.

@ Tweed - well I tell you what. I'll be the first guy to stand up and say that I'm not scared of those f*ers, and I will go down there. Not by myself mind you, that's how people end up at the bottom of the lake with some cement shoes, but I will go down there with anyone that is willing to stand up for their civil rights.

Remember, they work for us. which means we shouldn't have to feel scared to walk around in our town. (I call it our town, because I have grown quite fond of this place, and all it's wonderful eccentricities.)

i think that if enough people were to stand up and say that this isn't right, then something would have to be done. It works everywhere else, why wouldn't it work here?

SHAME ON YOU FRESNO PD, SHAME ON YOU, THIS IS VERY VERY SAD

My cousin the cop's take after seeing the video:

After further review.......

From the first part of the audio, I can safely assume that the people video taping are all wearing tie-dye shirts, all have long, unkept hair and the male is wearing round wire frame glasses. The man describing the police as
Bash-turds totally distracted me from the video but according to Wikipedia, he was "right on, man..."

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"Bash-turd"
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Look up bash-turd in
Wiktionary, the free dictionary.

A bash-turd is a person who bashes or strikes a turd or someone of ill refute, more commonly that of a homeless person. The term bash-turd originated in 1993 during the alleged beating of Rodney King in L.A. by police officers trying to subdue an aggressive, uncooperative assailant.


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-- now back to my assessment --

His female friend who is much younger than he is, is wearing a blue colored sun dress which has been in need of an iron for several weeks. Although barefoot, she has to drive the 78' volkswagon van because he hasn't seen a license since his fishing days as a young child... back when he actually obeyed the law.

She calls him by a nic-name which changes on a weekly basis and he calls her "flower" because he doesn't actually know her real name and she thinks that is very "hip" of him to do so.

The question, "why are they sockin' him?" by the female clearly shows that although she was enrolled in a Jr. High school she didn't actually attend every class and she also cannot recall the name of the high school that she was supposed to attend nor the small town that she grew up in.

The shaking of the camera suggests to me that although the couple was "just passing by", they were actually heading to the meth lab to trade in the video camera that they just stole from her uncles house where she grew up (due to the court order and all).

When you disect the video you can see the prior image that they videotaped over was that of "flowers'" 12th birthday where her best gifts were a pack of smokes and a lizard named "scaley". (Scaley died 2 months later when Flower dropped him from her back pack when she ran away for the 3rd time)

The sound of the second man sitting in the back of the van tells me that he was picked up along the way and is just along for the ride and doesn't know either one of the hippies and soon after the video was taken, he jumps out of the van and runs for his life.

As far as the officers in the background are concerned, unless the homeless man had a knife or something it seemed to me that they were pretty rude.