Splashed across the front of yesterday's Bee was a story about the Fulton Mall with the headline, "Time to rip it out?" The story, by the always intrepid George Hostetter, looks forward to a week of meetings (Sept. 25-Oct. 2) aimed at shaping downtown's future. The Fulton Mall, of course, will be a hot topic.
The story, and its provocative headline, have drawn a lot of the response you'd expect: Downtown is dead. Rip it out. It's ugly. It's dirty. People just go to River Park anyway. Etc.
Meanwhile, Craig Scharton, Fresno's "downtown czar" started another interesting dialog on Mindhub about the "Fulton Mall" name. His point was basically that the indoor mall we know now is what killed the pedestrian mall that Fulton once was. So ours needs a different name that doesn't include the word "mall."
On the opposite side of all this is the "Save the Fulton Mall" movement on Facebook, which pre-dates both of these recent developments. It recently had an event to celebrate the mall, and is pushing for more awareness with bright green "Save the Fulton Mall" T-shirts.
Lots of questions from all of this: Should the Fulton Mall be "ripped out" (whatever that means)? If so, what should be there instead. If not, what would you change to make it more lively? Anything? Does it need a new name? If so, what?
And, of course, there's the long-debated question: Should be it be open up to traffic?
My opinion: There's nothing in Fresno with more potential than Fulton Mall. So, yes, it should be there. But it needs new life. People will go there, if there's more to draw them. But most of them are not going to go just out of the goodness of their heart. We need things they can only get downtown, only get on the mall.
A thriving entertainment district would do the trick. A few choice shopping/dining options that aren't anywhere else in town would too. I've seen downtown options and downtown opinions grow greatly in the last few years, Internet trolls be damned, so I know it can work. I would hope there's a way to preserve the tradition and character of the mall, while still updating it and giving it new drawing power for a new generation.
RELATED
For a list of upcoming meetings,downtown plans, etc. -- check out the Fresno Downtown Plans website.
[photo: Gary Kazanjian / The Bee]
For what it's worth -- I was working on this post yesterday when The Beehive broke. It's a day late, but whatever.
Save it, rejuvenate it as a pedestrian entertainment district. That would be awesome. Spend any money we can get on wayfinding, lighting, facade improvements, and entertainment/restaurant business incentives.
It'll be awesome.
kill it. seriously i still dont understand why money is constantly going to re-make downtown. wasn't the stadium supposed to do that? downtown is a lost cause, people would rather go shopping in nice and safe areas.
So your solution is to just put a fence around it, toxic-waste-style, and move on? Sorry, but cities with dead downtowns don't flourish. Having a decrepit inner core affects everyone in the city -- even those who want to shop in "nice and safe" areas.
So we just keep throwing money into the money pit, hoping people and businesses will come downtown?
The way I see it, there is no amount of Fulton Mall revamping that will eliminate the concentrated pockets of poverty that envelop Fresno's downtown, and THAT is why people don't feel safe going there.
We can't fix the decrepit inner core of Fresno without fixing it's poverty and joblessness, which is among the worst in the entire country. So why all this fuss over Fulton Mall? We have MUCH bigger fish to fry.
As for renaming it.... I think Shakespeare said it best:
A mall by any other name would still stink like the urine of homeless people....
... also it would still have nothing but stores selling quinceanera dresses, be overly hot and have no parking... Ah, I love the Bard.
I would suggest that the person that posted this comment check out the crime rate between NE Fresno & Downtown Fresno. You might be very surprised how "safe" your shopping comfort zone really is in comparison.
KILL EVERYTHING AND EVERYONE THAT ISN'T PERFECT. that's the final solution!
Brittney, if it were true, that money is constantly going to re-make downtown it wouldn't have defunct fountains, and abandoned buildings.
And since you mentioned safety as a reason for not going downtown, you should check this website out. It appears that you are more likely to be a victim of crime north of downtown.
http://www.crimereports.com/map??search=Fresno,CA&crimeID=45728522
That misconception needs to stop downtown is not a dangerous area look it up and you'll find it is actually has one of the lowest crime rates in the entire city!
Hello Brittney. I'm with you. Kill it!!!
We keep asking the same questions over and over again as though we are magically going to stumble on the perfect solution. There is no perfect answer or one true way to revive the mall (or downtown for that matter). But there is one wrong way and that's to give up on it and forget it.
The key is moving forward with something. Open it up to traffic? Sure. Turn it into an outlet mall? Sounds good. Dance clubs and bars? Great. Farmer's Market? Why not. Let's do them all or let's do some of them. But dang it, let's do something. There's always going to be desent and differences of opinion. I bet if we were to look back to when the Riverpark development was being built there was probably some major dissent going on then too. "No one will ever shop on that end of town...it's just dirt and weeds out there!" But did that stop Ed Kashian and his group from pulling it off? No way. We spend too much time trying to convince everyone with our words and not enough time showing them in our actions. The more we keep debating this topic the more time we waste our energy that could be used in producing positive results.
Craig Scharton and his group are moving us into the right direction. Let's get together as a community and stand with them to do whatever is necessary to make this work. Will their be failures along the way? Absolutely. But it's still worth doing and I guarantee at some point we'll reach our goal - a vibrant, living downtown that makes our city just that much better.
And just for some perspective, downtown Fresno IS growing and getting better. Compare it to what it was just 10 years ago and the difference is staggering. Let's keep it going but just pick up the pace a bit.
Driving through the mall or leaving it as a walking mall are not what I think about with regard to whether I visit the Fulton Mall.
I rarely visit the downtown Fulton Mall for two main reasons: the businesses are not compelling, and there is no free parking, nor convenient parking.
I detest the design of RiverPark, yet I go there at least occasionally because there are some businesses that are worth the effort: Sierra Nut House, BevMo, Sur La Table, REI. Fig Garden Village: convenient, easy parking, variety, close by. There are places of interest both day and night in FGV.
It's a difficult problem, and I admire that there are people who care about its future rather than give up. Some bold steps need to be taken to draw established businesses whether local or chain into the mall or its vicinity. I don't know what those steps are, maybe tax relief or some other incentive.
Massive rebuild. Lower cost parking or free with validation.
Save it!! but it is going to take an insane amount of money to do so and "revitalize" it
we all can only do so much with clean ups and stuff like that
Very large investors and MONEY will be needed for the mall to ever be anything
:(
Are three decades of failure still not long enough to say, "Enough!" All but a few of the 60's-70's once popular downtown malls have been ripped out. We keep getting fresh batches of hopefuls to prolong this agony.
Necessary structures have to be in place for a pedestrian mall to succeed and downtown Fresno doesn't have them i.e. narrow funky streets and a close neighborhood university population surrounded by an attached wealthy neighborhood.
It doesn't need to look like Van Ness. We can have traffic and downtown still look cool.
I'm sure people would feel safer if the mall's lights were turned on at night. But, alas, that's a bridge too far for this administration...
RENAME IT!!!
Downtown Fresno Mall
And for those who don't like it, just keep on calling it the Fulton Mall.
ok, its renamed.
hmm. i don't see anything that changed.
the name is not the problem. it people looking for a quick fix solution that are the problem.
josh phano is right about one thing: its time to DO. fear of doing the wrong thing has crippled downtown for too long.
I'd like to see a couple of the small Tower District entertainment venues relocate there. As much as I respect the Tower, there is unlimited potential downtown.
In my opinion it needs a re-branding. It has a negative appeal to it for anyone who lives in the fresno area. In Clovis the overall opinion of it is that it's crawling with the homeless. I think it should be renamed to a strip or something else gimmicky, like River Park. I believe that there's a lot to be learned from River Park. For one it needs better access and more attractions. If they can't offer free parking then it needs solid attractions. I'm not going to pay for parking to stores that I feel are on the same level as a swap meet. I feel it has great potential but, I believe it's passed it's moment of opportunity. With options like River Park, Fashion Fair, and Sierra Vista Mall why would a business take a chance on a failed development. Especially in hard economic times like now. I don't believe that the southeast side of Fresno has the consumers for something like a River Park. For a prime example of that just look at Granite Park. It's sad to say but I don't believe it has a chance, at least as it stands right now.
I am over the Fulton Mall.
Not that I don't think it has wonderful potential or that it shouldn't be saved or reformed or transformed, but the mall has a ton of baggage and the ratio of energy (debating/planning/talking) to action is close to nill.
So either DO something, anything (which I can get behind and support), or let it go and let's direct our efforts someplace else (another part of the Fulton corridor, the cultural arts/mural district).
I will say, it seems like there has been forward movement and that's a positive.
I have to agree with you. I've seen far too much talk about this issue, and nearly no action. It's hard to keep caring.
did anyone say kill it yet?
kill it.
How about Union Square?
I love the Fulton Mall. Unfortunately, my love of the Mall will do nothing to undo the decades of damage wrought by the very government that once again is talking about fixing what ails downtown.
As much as I'd like to see the mall saved, the truth is I don't believe that will happen. First of, there are all those fountains, many of them just don't work like they used to. Then there are the property owners who are opposed to saving the Mall.
Two-way traffic is going to end the woes of downtown either. The idea of a meandering one-way street with diagonal parking stalls, parts of the Mall can be preserved, the artwork moved. I can only wonder what will become of the play areas at the north and south ends of the Mall.
The City should be proactive and use eminent domain to remove the blighted eyesore sitting on the corner of Van Ness and Inyo.
The ideas of ignoring downtown are absurd. Money will be spend, it becomes a question of when, where and on what. The City needs to offer incentives to promote the growth of new businesses downtown, as well as to those businesses already there. Why doesn't the City create the same incentives for downtown that has seen the ever northward development?
For me that's what makes reaching for the middle worth a try instead of people arguing over their absolutes. Ripping it out is an absolute. Leaving it alone is an absolute in the sense that in 30 years it's the same un-attraction.
So I think a solution like this could help both sides come to some kind of DO about it.
One lane of very slow traffic, little change of the mall = minimal cost, windows of time traffic is allowed.
See what happens.
If it works and takes off, with little effort the mall can be reverted to what it was meant to be in the very first place.
If it fails I'm sure there are a few contractors with D-9's that'd give a good rate.
I'm with Famous here. I certainly wouldn't mind it if there were "a little less conversation, a little more action." There has been talk about fixing this mall since long before I was even born and how much has been actually done? Effectively nothing as far as I can tell.
All that to say, I don't think another decade of meetings and a possible name change is going to accomplish much.
I believe in Downtown revitalization but it's going to take alot of money which the City doesn't have to change the fresnans opinons of Fulton Mall. It's hard to change years of "developers urban sprawl" mentality. Growth will continue northward. Fulton Mall in the 70's, then Manchester in the 80's, then Fashion Fair, then RIver Park. Lay Fulton Mall to rest. But the key is getting people to work there and live there. Im a born and bread Fresnan but am jealous of other Valley cities half our size in which they have a vibrant downtown with great nightlife such as Visalia and Modesto. Fresno can stand to learn a thing or two from these cities.
The fault of all of this is in the manner that the pocketbook controllers of both the city and county allowed the center or downtown to become the SOUTH end of town. It only took them 30 years to move everything new to the north. A circular city design was too academic for the greedy and powerful back then.
The people who created Fulton were visionaries,but someone made off with the extra cash that should have glassed it in and provided air-conditioning and expansive free parking. High rise hotels and new shopping malls were allowed in too soon and the special effects of the art/mall were soon smothered by court,law offices,public buildings and a lack of checking typical Californian sprawl and flight.
I wish there was an easy answer. Perhaps we should have moved Fresno further north and created a tourist oasis in the S.J. desert like Palm Springs and named it Fulton de la Creme !
It's fun to fantasize in a place that is and has long been controlled by conservatives, who,as is now readily apparent to most Americans,are incapable of being socially progressive in any manner.It's part of your history,Fresno. Could there be a cure in your future ?
Validated parking - yes
more lighting - yes
more security - I'm assuming this is needed, at least at night
I haven't walked through the mall since 2003 & I wasn't scared at all, but it was day time. But it did seem like a lonely place, in the since that there wasn't much to offer there.
an incentive for local or chain businesses to occupy a space in the Fulton mall - yes please
There are a lot of entrepreneurs in town who would like to run a successful brick & mortar business. But cost of renting such spaces can be too much for some people to want to or even be able to jump right in & start running their business. I'd love to have my own space somewhere, set up with a consultation room & my display cakes out for everyone to see. I have a few business adventures that I'd like to embark upon, but it does require money & probably a lot of it! But if there were some incentive that the city could provide to business owners it could be what is needed to get the business people want and to get the people to come down to Fulton Mall.
It's true a lot of people that live here focus on River Park or other areas of town. But, when people come in from out of town for a convention or any function down town then they are going to stay in a down town hotel. There needs to be plenty of things for them to enjoy & do while they are staying in town for a night or two. If we completely let it go & there is nothing there, then it will become a place for bums to live because it's empty anyway. If someone comes from out of town & they see it the way it is now, or if we let it go then they will get an impression that no body cares. And the business on the north end of town will continue to get all of the business because no one is willing to try to do something to make down town a destination for anyone.
i agree with caroline that an incentive would be nice. i would HAPPILY and READILY open a business on the fulton mall (i've looked into it), if it weren't so darn expensive! for the same amount of $$ or less i can open in north fresno with more foot traffic.
maybe a championship winning roller derby team will improve the "maul"'s image ;)
Save it. Name change idea is borderline ridiculous.
Raise the rent on all the swap meet Louie stores and get them out. Invite IKEA to move into the old JC Pennies building. Neon light a couple of tall buildings for a nice skylight. Turn the mall into a outlet mall. Invite bars, clubs, and coffee shops for a bar hopping experience, without driving. Bring the arts back. Build a skate park. And last but not least place a new digital clock on top of the Secuity Bank building. Let's save downtown! River Park is wack!!
Greg is right:
Neon light a couple of tall buildings for a nice skylight. Invite bars, clubs, and coffee shops for a bar hopping experience, without driving. Bring the arts (and our beautiful fountains, perfect in a hot climate!!) back. Build a skate park (and plant lots more trees!). And last but not least, place a new digital clock on top of the Security Bank building. Let's save downtown(and the Fulton Mall as-is)! River Park is wack!!
I see a lot of talk about "less converstation" and "more action". Two words people: GET INVOLVED! It's easy to say kill it for those who have never attended a City meeting and really know nothing about the area or the intentions to revive it, but with anything until there is involvement, there is little progress. I work Downtown and feel safer here than the parking lot of Fashion Fair.
I work downtown and cross the Fulton Mall every day. There are already businesses there. All are ethnic and seem to be well patronized. Many have been there for a long time. Why don't we try something like a cultural district with more shops, more restaurants, and entertainment?
It's a pedestrian mall, why not try to capitalize on that? I attended a couple of Fuse Fests down there (concerts at various venues) and that seemed to be successful. Why can't we do that every time? Cabbies can take people from restaurant to theater to parking.
And leave the Tower District alone. They've done everything THEMSELVES. We shouldn't try to disturb that in any way.
Let's try to get more government offices down there too. How about we move the State Board of Equalization from North Palm on the Bluffs to the old Bank of Italy/America building?
Of course, all this will take money the city doesn't have. I don't want to throw any more money down the pit. Probably isn't a good time to even think about spending more $$ when we're cutting services and raising utility rates.
As a Fresno resident, it is difficult to miss the ongoing dialogue about how to solve
Downtown Fresno’s vitality issues. Everyone seems to have an opinion of what would be best and from some of the internet posts on the issue it seems there are some who want to give up on the project. This would be a disaster. Currently, the Fulton Mall is positioned for a comeback and has seen promising growth over the last couple years. Throwing in the towel now would reverse all the positive improvements that have been made. It is the time to save Downtown; not by pouring money on the problem, but by strategically targeting key areas that will bring in private investors that will sustain the economy and facilitate growth. Now is the time for a solid plan that is executed by competent professionals who have had success in downtown revitalization in the past.